Sp maps added and reviewed in 2015

Started by anvil, 18 November 2015, 16:41:48

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anvil

Since the beginning of 2015, very few old sp maps were added and reviewed here.
Any plans for this site to be more active again with this?

Forge

I've been through a plethora of computer issues that kept me inactive for several months while I resolved the hardware and OS issues - and real life has been keeping me off the computer. Note how long it took me to get around to replying to this.

I haven't done much in the way of playing games, but I'll get around to playing Duke again.
Also note that this site is open to anyone who wishes to submit maps and reviews.
Take it down to the beach with a hammer and pound sand up your ass

Forge

#2
TBH, I've been in a slump ever before my comp went down. I'm having a hard time finding any motivation to even play the game. Part of it is because I feel 'pressured' to do a review if I play a map - after basically forcing myself to do hundreds of reviews over a few years to get this site up to par with the other map hosting sites, the two aspects have became inseparable.

The other part of it is I'm just not feeling it anymore for the site itself. I only have two associations with this site - forum mod, and content.

There have been instances of people posting their thoughts and opinions which didn't align with the site's owner (Puritan), which Puritan basically overrode what little authority I have when he deleted the posts instead of letting me handle the situation. When discussed in a sidebar in the admin thread I was told that he (Puritan) didn't give a fuck about the forum and would just as soon remove it from the site than deal with insubordinate forum members.
So this pissed a few people off and let me know that I wasn't really needed to moderate.

As far as content is concerned - Puritan has done a great job providing a platform for all the long hours of writing I've done. It's his baby, he pays the bills, but I have absolutely no control over the files and content that I provide. I figured after all that work and all these years I'd at least have earned some access trust to be able to directly submit reviews and files to the server. Instead I have to bundle everything into an email like some person who just randomly wandered in off the internet, send it off, then wait until Puritan gets around to uploading it (sometimes he does it right away, sometimes it can take several days). If there are corrections to be made to the text, or the map got a quick update - then it can get in a situation where the review and file may be incorrect for several days before getting 'fixed'. (If the file itself even gets replaced).
There's also been incidents of where people want to update a map that's being hosted (either a one time deal, or multiple times) - the 'policy' has been set where it's pretty much one and done. Once it's been uploaded to the site, it is now buried in concrete and can't be moved. This has pissed a few people off - I wouldn't mind replacing the files (a hundred times if needed - i'd like the latest and greatest content and what best represents the mappers work to be hosted), but I have no access. It ends up where I feel like I have to go begging to Puritan on the mappers behalf to get any changes done. Then it's even more fun when I have to go back to the mapper and tell them 'no'. Add in that there have been a few sidebar discussions related to these things and a couple times the site's been threatened to be taken down by the owner (which I doubt will happen). It kinda gives me the impression that I'm wasting my time with all the hours I've invested in putting together reviews.

I can understand some points of view; if someone complained about not liking the front page format and that it needs to be changed, it would be equivalent to someone complaining that a review or score doesn't do their map justice - they'd get an 'eff you', but those aren't the issues an I'm not in the business of telling people 'eff you'.

I've received a load of flak for the inflexibility of the site, and there isn't a damn thing I can do about it. I like Puritan, and he's a good person, but sometimes he can be too much of a hardass. It's his site and he can run it as he sees fit, but I'm not feeling it, and I'm tired of some of the messages I have to field about the forum and the files hosted because I'm associated with the site and it's assumed I have some control over it. 
Take it down to the beach with a hammer and pound sand up your ass

MSandt

Quote from: Forge on  19 January 2016, 16:18:14
I've received a load of flak for the inflexibility of the site, and there isn't a damn thing I can do about it. I like Puritan, and he's a good person, but sometimes he can be too much of a hardass. It's his site and he can run it as he sees fit, but I'm not feeling it, and I'm tired of some of the messages I have to field about the forum and the files hosted because I'm associated with the site and it's assumed I have some control over it.

Yeah that's the problem with using design templates.
"Whatever their future, at the dawn of their lives, men seek a noble vision of man's nature and of life's potential." -Howard Roark

Forge

#4
It's not the exact same situation, but an analogy to it would be what happened to DN-R. Kim went mia and people were expecting miracles out of Puritan to keep the site running and up to date. He could only do so much.
I'm in a similar quandary; even though the owner is present I have no way to do or change anything except through begging. It's frustrating when you're trying to sway someone who is less flexible than brick. 'If their map wasn't done, then they shouldn't have released it."
Sometimes beta-testers miss things and after release a player can find an exploit that allows them to run around the back of a map like a mario cheat. It happens.

I'm also not Numan. I don't go around behind forum members and modify or delete their posts just because I don't like their criticism. I'd rather discuss out the issue than to say 'eff you, if you don't like it then piss off and go else where'. Not a very good way to establish a community or friendly environment imo.

Been told that I need to get a thick skin about these things. I do, but there are aspects where I'm willing to work with people. Unfortunately I'm not in a position where I can do anything about anything. I'm just burnt out from dealing with all the mails and messages which turn me into a middle-man or give me grief about how the site is run.
Take it down to the beach with a hammer and pound sand up your ass

Merlijn

Late reaction - but thanks for the explanation Forge.
To be honest, I was wondering why new maps didn't receive reviews anymore.

But sounds like a lot of trouble indeed, too bad because I always enjoy reading your reviews.
I can do some write ups as well, I've played most new releases so I could at least cover those.

Don't expect top notch quality reviews though..

Forge

#6
You made me re-read what I posted.

To be clear, I'm not trying to paint Puritan as the 'bad guy'. He worked hard to put this site together and he can manage it any way he wants. How he runs it is no big secret, so most people should know what to expect.

My grief comes from myself and everyone else.

Example: Some individuals post their opinion on how this site should be ran, it usually gets explained to them why it is the way it is. The person gets argumentative. Their posts get deleted by Puritan. I'm the global moderator. I'm the one who catches all the flak for deleted posts.

Example: Someone releases a map. I review and upload it. A major flaw is discovered in the map -or- I apparently jumped the gun to get it hosted and the map was supposedly a beta or some such thing.  The 'policy' is once it's uploaded there had better be a damn good reason why it needs to be updated. Sometimes it does get updated, sometimes not. It's the 'not' instances that are so much joy. Now I have a handful of mappers that are pissed at me, don't trust me, and no longer want me to do reviews on their work. 

Just a small slice of all the animosity I get. I'm tired of it.


I was just whining that if I had access to change reviews and files then I could alleviate about 99% of the grief I have.
Again, it's Puritan's site and he doesn't want anyone but himself to have access to the files on the server. It could be that he has more than duke files on the server, he's afraid I might screw something up, he's worried about security, whatever. Doesn't matter. His money, his investment. If I had a brand new sports car I wouldn't loan it out to just anybody, so I don't blame him.
Take it down to the beach with a hammer and pound sand up your ass

Merlijn

IIRC the "no updates" rule was installed after some authors kept rereleasing new patches of their map? I can see how that's annoying for a site like this. Several new patches are understandable if it's a big TC or a mod, but a single level?

Sorry to hear that you received so much negative feedback. :\

MSandt

Quote from: Merlijn on  13 March 2016, 18:57:54
IIRC the "no updates" rule was installed after some authors kept rereleasing new patches of their map? I can see how that's annoying for a site like this. Several new patches are understandable if it's a big TC or a mod, but a single level?

That "some authors" is Paul Bolduc. He's a bit OCD about fixing menial bugs which would be fine if it concerned only him. Reviews are also not beta testing platforms; you cannot just keep fixing the map and expect the review to be updated every step of the way. That's what beta testers are for. (Not saying Bolduc has engaged in this kind of behavior but several others have.) But of course a draconian no-updates policy is silly and in general mappers should be encouraged to update their maps (within limits!).
"Whatever their future, at the dawn of their lives, men seek a noble vision of man's nature and of life's potential." -Howard Roark

Forge

#9
Quote from: Merlijn on  13 March 2016, 18:57:54
Sorry to hear that you received so much negative feedback. :\
I love being told that my reviews are pure garbage, and that I'm a worthless piece of shit that should go off and die in a ditch.
- all over wanting to update a map file and being told no.

That's not every time. Some people are like,"Meh. Whatever", and a few ask to not have any more of their maps hosted here.

The whole thing is a catch 22. I know you'd never bitch at me about something like this, but if I review your work then I'm going to get other people asking me to review theirs. If I say no, refer to the first sentence of this post. If I say yes, eventually the situation will come full circle and I'll be getting threats in my inbox again.
Take it down to the beach with a hammer and pound sand up your ass

Merlijn

I would make sure my map gets properly tested before I release it, so we would never have that problem. :)
But I also agree with Mikko, there should be room for exceptions.

On a side note, it's too bad there's so much vitriol in this community.
Not just your examples, but I also see it on the duke4 forums a lot. Now there's another shitstorm involving Sanek and it's just tiresome. No wonder there a fewer and fewer releases..

Makes me long back to the good ol' AMC days.

James

Quote
Makes me long back to the good ol' AMC days.
From what I remember Alejandro did actually keep backups of all of the reviews but never got round to converting them into any new kind of format so they've been lost to the ages. It does suck a bit.

Forge

#12
Quote from: Merlijn on  13 March 2016, 23:19:15
I would make sure my map gets properly tested before I release it, so we would never have that problem. :)
hypothetically, if a large flaw was found after release and you were denied the opportunity to update; you probably wouldn't be happy, but you also wouldn't insult or threaten me either. That's not the kind of person you are. (you'd have your brother do it for you).

Quote from: Merlijn on  13 March 2016, 23:19:15
On a side note, it's too bad there's so much vitriol in this community.
Not just your examples, but I also see it on the duke4 forums a lot. Now there's another shitstorm involving Sanek and it's just tiresome. No wonder there a fewer and fewer releases..

Makes me long back to the good ol' AMC days.
good ol' days.
It does seem that as the community ages and releases get fewer and farther in between, that (some) people releasing stuff get saltier about their maps. Really encouraging listening to people complain about not getting the recognition they deserve.
Take it down to the beach with a hammer and pound sand up your ass

anvil

Quote from: James on  13 March 2016, 23:26:57
From what I remember Alejandro did actually keep backups of all of the reviews but never got round to converting them into any new kind of format so they've been lost to the ages. It does suck a bit.
Speaking of lost things, I don't understand why hundreds of maps and episodes weren't archived in dukeworld.com back in the day.
It only took one guy to take care of it. I guess no one really cared about it.

anvil

Quote from: Merlijn on  13 March 2016, 23:19:15
No wonder there a fewer and fewer releases..
The number of releases has been very low in the past decade, and it could get worse.
Imo, the way to increase it drastically is 3-4 mapping contests per year with prizes.
Where would the budget come from? don't ask me, but I will only say this: increasing the number of releases should be top priority and if I was the owner of Duke4.net, I would try to reduce expenses in order to have enough budget for this.